Adding another HDD

19 replies [Last post]
KeithReeman
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Joined: Apr 5 1999

My pc is based on an MSI KT6V mobo, and at present I have 4 ide devices fitted, 3xhdd and a dvdrewriter.

I would like to add another hdd, probably about 200/250Gb for video storage/editing. I have a number of options, and would welcome opinions on which way to go.

The options are:-
1. Replace an existing hdd (but this means the net gain would be smaller).
2. Use a caddy system (I have the caddies already).
3. Add an external firewire hdd (extra cost involved in the case).
4. Add a SATA drive (the mobo supports SATA 1 and I understand SATA 2 is backward compatible).

Any thoughts/guidance will be gratefully received.

Keith

Alan Craven
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Joined: Jan 26 2001

I have both caddies and external fireware and USB disks, and for me Caddies beat the other hands down for regular use.

I actually no longer have the caddy in the system tower but in a dual bay firewire box, together with a multi-format DVD burner. I have not tried capturing to this, but I can edit using Premiere pro 1.5, and export to tape from the HDD in the box.

harlequin
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Joined: Aug 16 2000

From my life of pain
1. don't swap to new drives , it needs juggling to get all present dat onto drives you end up with
2. caddies are fine , but still means the wrong drive will be in the system when you need specific files ( murphy's law )
3. external firewire are , in my opinion , the best idea. ( although external sata kits ( esata ) are pretty cheap now for card/empty external case )
4. sata works , BUT , if a sata drive dies ..... it's dead ..... pata can usually have some data recoverred from them. Buy the lockable sata cables for the drive connection , it stops them being knocked off when you open the case sides , the simpla sata connectors don't appear to hold very well.

I have just had to ship the first of my 4 250GB pata drives back to maxtor via dealer due to it failing constantly with crc errors .........
That set of drives have not even been in my machine 9 months. ( drives were manufactured january 2006 ) ...... and weren't installed till after videoforum this year.
5 year warranty ..... and they last 9 months ........

Gary MacKenzie

sepulce@hotmail.com ( an account only used for forum messages )

Thinkserver TS140 , 750ti Graphics card  & LG 27" uws led backlight , Edius 8

Humax Foxsat HD Pvr / Humax Fox T2 dvbt

Alan Roberts
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Joined: May 3 1999

I now do everything on laptops, including editing HDTV. So all significant drives are external. Don't go for USB, Firewire is best for video. Caddies are fine, I have several old drives in caddies that go into a firewire/USB box.

Get my test cards document, and cards for 625, 525, 720 and 1080. Thanks to Gavin Gration for hosting them.
Camera settings documents are held by Daniel Browning and at the EBU
My book, 'Circles of Confusion' is available here.
Also EBU Tech.3335 tells how to test cameras, and R.118 tells how to use the results.

caryjoy
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Joined: May 10 2005

Firewire externals for me all the way, just plug & play. And you can disconnect when you want to use the data with another system.

Alan Roberts
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Joined: May 3 1999

Yep, that's how I move data around. My laptops are all networked, but I use external drives to move data, it's quicker. I use USB connection when it's data files, Firewire when it's video. Most of my boxes do both.

Get my test cards document, and cards for 625, 525, 720 and 1080. Thanks to Gavin Gration for hosting them.
Camera settings documents are held by Daniel Browning and at the EBU
My book, 'Circles of Confusion' is available here.
Also EBU Tech.3335 tells how to test cameras, and R.118 tells how to use the results.

Alan Craven
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Joined: Jan 26 2001

The major advantage of the caddy in a firewire box is that the box has an internal power supply, so all the drives I use with it are in small independent boxes and just plug into the firewire box - no messing about with power supplies. As ChrisG notes elsewhere, power supplies are anything but standard.

The box is generally connected to my editing machine, but only switched on when needed. If I want to use it with another machine, all I have to do is pull the firewire and IEC mains leads from the back and take it away, replacement is obviously just as easy.

Dave R Smith
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Joined: May 10 2005

I agree with previous feedback.
I started with external HDD via firewire. When I turn pc off, the external HDD also turns off 'by magic' so no hassle there - protected by rcd's of course.
External HDD getting full, so now also have icy box caddy system - docked inside pc.

No differerence noticed on speed etc, but if you had a large projet to pass over to a third party for whatever reason - the external HDD would be easier for t'other person to receive and just plug in.

Also I keep output files (avi/mpg) seperate from project files (all source files), so that if external HDD goes, I can re-create from source and if source goes I won't have lost the output file. Haven't had to test the theory to date though.

...oh - for a continually expanding system, the internal drives are cheaper than external HDD.

KeithReeman
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Joined: Apr 5 1999

Thanks to everyone for the replies. It's a toss up between a caddy and external firewire. Swapping between systems is not an issue for me, it's really about expanding my storage space. If this is organised on a project basis then the caddy would work fine (noting Gary's sods law point of course), but if I decide my requirement is for more video storage, then the coin comes down for external firewire. Hmmm, some more thinking/planning to be done.

Keith

mooblie
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Joined: Apr 27 2001
KeithReeman wrote:
It's a toss up between a caddy and external firewire.

Keith, just to re-iterate, I think several people here (myself included) use both together: i.e. caddies in external firewire cases - getting the benefits of both systems. They're not mutually exclusive.

Martin - DVdoctor in moderation. Everyone is entitled to my opinion.

Alan Roberts
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Joined: May 3 1999

Exactly, my most useful package is an external with a USB port and firewire through-connection, with a caddy. Swapping drives around is a dream, and I can make use all my old, small drives this way. That said, I've also got a couple of ADS Pyro firewire-only cases and a Lacie. But I most often use the caddy box because I don't ofetn have to move vast amounts around, only huge amounts.

Get my test cards document, and cards for 625, 525, 720 and 1080. Thanks to Gavin Gration for hosting them.
Camera settings documents are held by Daniel Browning and at the EBU
My book, 'Circles of Confusion' is available here.
Also EBU Tech.3335 tells how to test cameras, and R.118 tells how to use the results.

KeithReeman
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Joined: Apr 5 1999

Point taken Mooblie, I didn't phrase my reply too well. Can anyone point me in the direction of external firewire cases that will accommodate a caddy?

Many thanks
Keith

mooblie
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Joined: Apr 27 2001

I use these from Span, but any external FW case that can take a 5.25" drive (either a single drive or multiple drives) should take a caddy/caddies.

For caddies, I use these.

Martin - DVdoctor in moderation. Everyone is entitled to my opinion.

Alan Craven
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Joined: Jan 26 2001
mooblie wrote:
I use these from Span, but any external FW case that can take a 5.25" drive (either a single drive or multiple drives) should take a caddy/caddies.

For caddies, I use these.

You can get caught by caddies that are too long. My first effort came to grief with one of these - a beautiful box, but too short for my heavy duty LianLi caddy system.

http://www.span.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=19_1302_1322&products_id=1080

These, on the other hand are fine:

http://www.span.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=19_1302_1322&products_id=1061

They will take a second drive as well, and are very good quality, with a built in power supply.

Alan Roberts
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Joined: May 3 1999

Agreed, the caddies are long, I've got a single enclosure from Span and have haqcked it a bit to get a caddy in, looks a bit odd but it works.

The only problem with the double enclosure is that it has only a single firewire port. I looked at and rejected that because I now do everything on laptops, and have only one firewire port on each. The enclosure I ended up with has USB2 and 2 firewire ports, so I can daisy-chain a camera or acd/dac or more drives on firewire.

Get my test cards document, and cards for 625, 525, 720 and 1080. Thanks to Gavin Gration for hosting them.
Camera settings documents are held by Daniel Browning and at the EBU
My book, 'Circles of Confusion' is available here.
Also EBU Tech.3335 tells how to test cameras, and R.118 tells how to use the results.

mooblie
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Joined: Apr 27 2001

I have two Span double FW enclosures - one has TWO FW400 ports, the other has a FW400 port AND a FW800 port.

I guess they can vary in configuration, as Alan R. has seen a single port variant. Best to check with Span first.

Martin - DVdoctor in moderation. Everyone is entitled to my opinion.

Mike Walters
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Joined: Oct 29 2002

Hi all,
I've just posted a question about SATA drives on here but reading this it has given me an idea or two.
Firstly though i always thought external drives either USB2 or Firewire were too slow for video editing? Is that no longer the case? Is it possible to capture to and edit from these using my Matrox RTx 100 system or will they be too slow for realtime effects etc? If it is possible this might just have solved my problems.
Mike

Alan Craven
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Joined: Jan 26 2001
mooblie wrote:
I have two Span double FW enclosures - one has TWO FW400 ports, the other has a FW400 port AND a FW800 port.

I guess they can vary in configuration, as Alan has seen a single port variant. Best to check with Span first.

This Alan has two firewire ports on his IB-2FC box (as the code suggests?)! The box came with SCSI connections and a firewire/PATA bridge board which had to be swapped for them.

The blurb on the Worldspan Site describes it as "2 port". The bridge is the IB FB911P - 2 port.

I notice that the equivalent boxes with other port combinations, eg USB2/Firewire are now all SATA.

KeithReeman
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Joined: Apr 5 1999

Thanks everyone for the pointers. I shall do a bit more research/searching before making a purchase.
Keith

harlequin
harlequin's picture
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Joined: Aug 16 2000
harlequin wrote:
From my life of pain
1. don't swap to new drives , it needs juggling to get all present dat onto drives you end up with
2. caddies are fine , but still means the wrong drive will be in the system when you need specific files ( murphy's law )
3. external firewire are , in my opinion , the best idea. ( although external sata kits ( esata ) are pretty cheap now for card/empty external case )
4. sata works , BUT , if a sata drive dies ..... it's dead ..... pata can usually have some data recoverred from them. Buy the lockable sata cables for the drive connection , it stops them being knocked off when you open the case sides , the simpla sata connectors don't appear to hold very well.

I have just had to ship the first of my 4 250GB pata drives back to maxtor via dealer due to it failing constantly with crc errors .........
That set of drives have not even been in my machine 9 months. ( drives were manufactured january 2006 ) ...... and weren't installed till after videoforum this year.
5 year warranty ..... and they last 9 months ........

My second ( of the 4 ) is also now dead.
Major failure on second raid1.

I am now down to only masters from both arrays functional.

Gary MacKenzie

sepulce@hotmail.com ( an account only used for forum messages )

Thinkserver TS140 , 750ti Graphics card  & LG 27" uws led backlight , Edius 8

Humax Foxsat HD Pvr / Humax Fox T2 dvbt